Hanne Willmann is being presented in the press as a new star of German furniture design. As one of the few women in the industry, this automatically makes her a role model.

Hanne, what motivates you to get up every morning and start working anew?

HW The feeling that it's not work. My work is my baby. I think it's like having a child for other people. It's perfectly clear that they have to feed this child. Many self-employed people probably know this feeling.

Ideally.

HW There are also self-employed people who run a company where monetary gain is the priority. But for me, design is like an expression of myself. Money is, of course, a helpful byproduct of good work, and it must always be in good proportion to the working hours. My goal is to always be able to take on more interesting and exciting projects.

You once told me that you're not so sure if you're an outstanding designer, but sometimes you feel like you get so much media attention because you're a woman. Is that a good thing or a bad thing?

HW Yes, in some situations such doubts arise. But then I can always reassure myself. After all, it's great if I can contribute to women in design being seen even more.

Do you perhaps grow into an image that is projected onto you from outside?

HW In the beginning, I was called a "newcomer." Meanwhile, I sometimes read "star designer," although I myself feel like I'm not there yet. But you shouldn't take such things too seriously. Of course, the press sometimes needs dramatization. Incidentally, I also believe that it's a good thing if women get more attention because they are women. Female role models need to be created. Abroad, there are some in product design, for example Patricia Urquiola or Inga Sempé. Nevertheless, there are still far too few. In Germany, we find even fewer women in these positions, at most these typical architect duos with husband and wife. But in the furniture industry, there just aren't that many. And if there are, the classic division in Germany is always: women tend to do ceramics, glass, and textiles, men do the big furniture. That's why I'm really grateful to be a role model. There are many young women, designers, and students who seek contact with me and want to know what it's like to be a woman in such a position.

"I was recently asked if I design in a typically feminine way. Then I wondered what exactly that was supposed to mean. For many, 'feminine' means soft and round, but I would never define it that way."

Do you see yourself as a role model?

HW I'm happy if I can be that for some, and I'm glad that I succeed in doing so without the unfortunately all too common "typically" masculine approach. Many women in leadership positions in Germany - Angela Merkel is the best example - often have to behave in this pseudo-masculine way to gain respect. I'm glad that this is not necessary in my case. I can just be myself and don't constantly have to categorize or question my gender. That's very pleasant.

Have you ever had a moment in a business context where someone said something sexist or misogynistic and you thought, I can't get political right now, otherwise I'll lose a contract?

HW In the beginning, that happened often. It's hard to distinguish whether you're being demeaned because you're young and a beginner, or because you're a woman. Both often go hand in hand. In magazine articles, for example, you are often belittled. That wouldn't happen with men. Most of the time, it's even women who write the corresponding headlines. On the other hand, I don't feel that it has had a detrimental effect in my case. But there have definitely been unpleasant cases. A manufacturer once asked me: "What would you like to do for us?" I replied that I would like to design a sofa or a shelving system. He then said: "With us, women are often more in the accessories area." He was a bit surprised that I wanted to design furniture. In fact, I also have some accessories in my portfolio - it's not like I only make system furniture. Nevertheless, I said that it was about time to let a woman do the big things and give the briefings for the accessories to the men. The client was impressed by this statement - and ultimately happy with the result. This example shows quite well how I deal with such a situation. By the way, the company is now insolvent.

It just needs someone to break down those barriers.

HW I recently had an encounter with an established, experienced businessman. He wanted to show me all the time that I had no idea. But when we walked through the production, he quickly realized that I did indeed have an idea. After all, I taught technology and construction for four years at the University of the Arts Berlin and at Anhalt University of Applied Sciences in Dessau. I often notice that I am not treated as an equal, especially at the beginning. Of course, I can't say whether that's also the case for men at the beginning. But in many cases, I would assume that women have to fight harder against prejudices.

You once called Pauline Deltour one of your role models. She's more or less your generation. Do you also have a female role model from the "legendary generation" of Dieter Rams or Jean Prouvé?

HW An old hand, so to speak?

Exactly, is there a woman?

HW Patricia Urquiola is not that old yet, so I can't mention her now. But fundamentally, I think she's great. She does it in a very feminine way. But I don't have much choice, one must also add. I can now perhaps choose between four women which one I find the most amazing. Of course, there are the old Bauhaus designers, but among the truly practicing women, I would say it's Patricia Urquiola. I read in an interview that she deliberately works "feminine" so that customers know that if they come to her, they consciously get feminine design. I myself have clearly decided against that. I can't do that.

What is feminine design even supposed to mean?

HW Sure, people talk about soft forms, warm things, bright and colorful colors, and so on. That's the stereotypical feminine. I was recently asked in an interview if I design in a typically feminine way or if I sometimes think about using that. Then I wondered what that was exactly supposed to mean. For many, "feminine" means soft and round, but I would never define it that way. I don't even have the connotations of "feminine" or "masculine" for design in my head. That time is also over.

Would you wish for the press to portray you differently or to report in a more nuanced way?

HW Sometimes, yes. It would be beneficial to talk more about how strong the women of our generation actually are. There are also articles about me, especially written by young women, in which I am portrayed very strongly and without female clichés.

That shows that there might be more behind it than just you as a person, but rather the topic that's currently in the air.

HW Yes, but sometimes also wishes: For example, I just got married. A journalist then said to me: "Oh God, don't have children now!" That was her image that she projected onto me: She is now writing about me, trusting in my talent and that I will become more famous in the coming years. On the one hand, she promotes me through this, on the other hand, she wants me to fulfill her wish to become more famous, not become a mother of three, and then not work anymore. I was briefly startled, but then immediately thought that in this case it might have nothing to do with gender, it's just her wish as a journalist.

But it's also intrusive.

HW Well, she meant well. I recently watched a panel where two men and one woman were interviewed. The woman was asked: "You're on the board here, how do you manage to combine that as a woman with your private life?" She said: "Yes, it's not easy, but I have a good nanny," and then half of the interview was just about how she manages her life as a woman.

This beleaguered life, so to speak.

HW Exactly, how can you combine womanhood, motherhood, and career? At the very end of the panel, a young woman stood up and asked the question: "Excuse me, I'd like to know, what about the men's private lives? How do they combine children and career, please?" Everyone cheered and clapped. I also got really angry. How can it be that for a woman, half an hour is not about her professional career at all, but only about her children? Why are women asked this and men are not?

Let's get back to your work. You work with many different materials. Is that something that is brought to you from the outside, or a personal decision?

HW For me, it is a matter of course to work sustainably. I don't constantly think about which PET is recycled – I don't even design with plastic, so the question doesn't arise. I love working with wood, a renewable resource, and I make sure to use regional wood. I have set myself the goal of only working with manufacturers who produce regionally. Although the regional aspect is always a thing. Let's say a Thai manufacturer produces in Thailand, then it is regional. If a German manufacturer produces in China, then the product has to be sent halfway around the world. I definitely want to avoid this intermediate step. I also work a lot with artisans, especially here in Germany. You can't really produce more sustainably and regionally. But if the product is thrown away after a year, then you gain nothing from the sustainability. That's why I hope that my products are either timeless, because they are so simple that they fit in everywhere, or so high-quality that people definitely want to keep them because of a personal connection to them. That's more the idea of sustainability that I have. And sure, if I were a sneaker designer now, then I would have to think about sustainability in a completely different way.

What things have particularly excited you from a technological perspective in recent years?

HW I'm really excited about designs that can be realized with 3D printing. I believe you just design differently with it. This is an old hat, but for example, if you construct a chair frame that needs to be made of metal or milled from wood, then you think about the complexity of the shape and how to reduce it so that as few work steps as possible are required. The price is determined by the complexity of the production or the frame. In 3D printing, the price is determined by weight or volume. That means you can make the craziest, most complicated frame in the world – if it has little volume and is full of holes, it's low-complexity for the printer and cheap. I find this switch between complexity and price that arises from 3D printing exciting. For me, it has had no impact at all so far, because the manufacturers I work with focus on craftsmanship, and honestly, so do I. Otherwise, I feel that I am technologically rather backward and currently work a lot with traditional crafts, such as glass or ceramics. I look at how things were made in the past and whether the techniques behind them can somehow be revived.

Would you say that furniture and accessory design and everything else that falls into this interior sector is gaining or losing relevance today?

HW I think we're at a turning point right now. We've been oversaturated with product design over the past five or ten years. The Danes have created product design "for all" with many brands. I'm not even talking about Ikea, but higher-end brands like Muuto and Hay. They've made it possible for us to have design in our homes with less money and at a younger age. But as a result, we've been completely inundated with stuff. I believe that a change is happening now, where people are consciously reducing to a few, but high-quality or special, beautifully produced items. This is a change that I very much welcome.

How does your design process work?

HW I find inspiration in different ways. A manufacturer might approach me. Then I look at their portfolio, find a gap, and start designing. But it can also be that an idea burns within me and I have to realize it. Mostly, I first put it on paper in sketch form. Then we actually immediately go into CAD [Computer-Aided Design] and start building there, and later into model making to test it. So there's a constant ping-pong between model and CAD. Then we render it and put it into a nice presentation, then it goes to the manufacturer, and as soon as they say they like it, it goes to prototype construction. Sometimes we do the development ourselves. It always depends a bit on what competencies the manufacturer has.

Another topic: We are surrounded by projects and products that reproduce and constantly reinforce gender-specific stereotypes instead of dissolving them.

HW Oh yes, getting worse and worse. Especially products for children. In my childhood, the toy sections weren't so strongly divided into blue and pink. That has gotten really bad.

What responsibility do designers bear in assigning such symbols? Do you think they should refuse to design certain things?

HW Absolutely. I just don't know to what extent the designers of Elsa from "Frozen" have this aspiration for themselves - or even have a chance to say anything. I wonder if there are even designers behind it or if it's just a marketing team? Such things are not particularly well-designed, the logo is slapped on from all sides, stickers are everywhere, and then a pink tutu is attached. I believe the responsibility also lies with us designers, but we hardly have the opportunity to get involved because we are too rarely involved in such processes.

Final question: Is there a woman, dead or alive, designer or not, with whom you would like to have coffee?

HW Oh, I have to think about that. I'd rather say a living woman - that might be more exciting, in case she hears about it or reads it and we can actually meet for coffee: Patricia Urquiola.